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Subject: finished your Amway story Thu, 22 Oct 1998 What's weird is, I was approached twice in one week by two different individuals, one in a computer store, the other in a book store. Each struck up similar conversations as to the one you had with Ted. Each gave me cards and said that they were expanding their businesses and looking for bright energetic people like me. Their lines are the same world wide I guess, and they all prospect in the same places. One month after the first two contacts, a person that did some consulting for the company that I worked for called me out of the blue. He explained that he had just started his own business in networking and needed some help. I being a Network Engineer was interested. After going to lunch and him pitching his MLM company he invited me to a meeting and upon arrival I was accosted by the suits, doctors, lawyers, all professionals. I faked a page midway through the meeting in which Amway was never mentioned, got home and told a friend, he said it sounded like Amway, I got on the internet and sure enough, it was. They had called the MLM the Britt System. Hmmm.... that is the Britt AMO. It's the next day and I've been at work reading all day about Amway on the net, and I can't wait till the ASSHOLE that brought me to that meeting calls me again.
Subject: Amway Story Thu, 22 Oct 1998 Hello, My name is Josh. I am a computer programmer. I was invited to Amway meeting couple of months ago by a friend of mine. Did not have time to go. Finally I went to the meeting last night. Honestly, I was very enthusistic after the meeting. This morning I went to their web site just to get some facts. During the browsing I came across the news letters. And read about the law suite and "The Untold Story". Did some seraching on "Amway - The Untold Story" and came across your site. Now I feel totally unenthusistic about joining Amway. Your story totally make sence. I am busy like hell, working 7 days a week, and don't have time and money to spend on Amway. Thanks.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 2) Sat, 24 Oct 1998 RUSS: I ENJOYED READING YOUR STORY; SORRY BUT I'M NOT HERE TO FLAME YOU. JUST A FEW MINOR POINTS TO GET OFF MY CHEST. I WAS AN ACTIVE AMWAY DISTRIBUTOR FROM 1990 TO 1994. IT WAS AN EDUCATION IN EVERY WAY-- SOME GOOD AND SOME BAD. I NEVER MADE MUCH MONEY. IN FACT, I SPENT WAY TOO MUCH MONEY AND TIME IN A FUTILE EFFORT TO MAKE MORE MONEY AND CREATE MORE TIME FOR MYSELF AND FAMILY. YOU'VE PROBABLY HEARD THAT BEFORE. I WANT TO UNDERSCORE THAT MOST OF THE TYPICAL CRITICISMS PEOPLE AIM AT AMWAY SHOULD MORE ACCURATELY BE TARGETED AT THE DISTRIBUTOR ORGANIZATIONS. THEY ARE THE ONES HEAVILY PROMOTING AND PROFITING FROM THE EDUCATIONAL EVENTS AND MATERIALS. AMWAY CORPORATION, ITSELF, IS VERY CAUTIOUS ABOUT THOSE KINDS OF THINGS. WHILE I AGREE THAT AMWAY'S PRICING IS A TAD STEEP, I ASSERT THAT A 30% PREMIUM ADDED TO THE COST IS LESS HARSH THAN THE OVERALL PRICE THAT PEOPLE PAY "KEEPING UP WITH THE JONESES" OR PRIORITIZING CAREER OVER FAMILY. MOST AMWAY-BASHERS MOCK THAT ASSERTION, BUT I FIND IT TO BE IRREFUTABLY TRUE. WHILE AMWAY MAY NOT BE THE BEST VEHICLE TO ESCAPE THE WORKADAY WORLD, ITS ORIGINAL AMBITION WAS NOBLE AND HAS BEEN DIRTIED BY THE DISTRIBUTOR ORGANIZATIONS AND THEIR GREED ($6.50 TAPES/ $10 SEMINARS/ $60 CONFERENCES). THE TAIL NOW WAGS THE DOG. I AM STILL INVOLVED IN THE NETWORK MARKETING INDUSTRY. THERE ARE GOOD COMPANIES OUT THERE THAT HOLD TO THE ORIGINAL VIEW OF ENABLING PEOPLE TO BUILD A PROFITABLE BUSINESS WITHOUT WRECKING THEIR LIVES EITHER SOCIALLY OR FINANCIALLY. BEST WISHES,
Subject: My reply to your Amway page Sat, 24 Oct 1998 Russell, Thanks for a very informative page! :) I had to go through a couple of hundred titles from Amway Distributors before I found your site. I did check out a few of these sites to do a fair search. A couple from my son's scout group met with us a few nights ago. I thought these people were good friends and wouldn't try to get us into anything that wasn't legitimate. My first impression on being told the first few facts was that it was a pyramid. One glance at the catalogs and prices told me I would be paying more for products than I do now. Their selling point was that things come directly to your house and you save on time and gas! Well I'll take the time to go to the store (I LOVE shopping) instead of selling products any day :) I plan on giving my friends this address and hope that it will help them realize what they've gotten into before they get more involved. Thank you so much for maintaining this site.
Subject: Finished your Amway story... Sun, 25 Oct 1998 Good story dude, I was recruited heavily to be a distributor by my aunt and joined for a time. I found it to be just like you said. Books and tapes and seminars. Books and tapes and seminars. The last straw came when our upline got upset that we wouldnt attend a function because my wifes sister was getting married the same weekend and we wanted to attend the wedding instead. "If its to be, its up to me!" Bullshit! Its up to the hundred other flunkies that you try to get under you. Screw Amway!!!!!!!!!!
Subject: Your Amway page... Sun, 25 Oct 1998 Hi! Looking for critical views on the herbalife scheme, I sort of stumbled into your pages. Skimmed through most of your stuff. Liked the clear observations on mind control. The little I've of the the the Herbalife deal gives me the impression that it is pretty much the same thing. Maybe slightly less cultish. Maybe slightly more goes back to the "distributors". (The end buyer gets to pay horrendous prices for fairly good stuff.) I have the impression that their tapes and stuff are free or very cheap. But a pyramid is still a pyramid. So, I wanted to thank you for the brain food, (so much crap on the net nowadays), and ask you what you know about Herbalife. Got any nice links? PS 66695 visitors should be pretty frightening to the Amway people, but I am afraid that the number of people stuck in ther net is probably even more so.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 3) Mon, 26 Oct 1998 I used to work for a guy who is very into Amway.....all over the salon, we had the tissues, Glister, the coffee, etc. Everything there was from Amway....He would also give us pep talks and use a lot of what I know now to be the Amway lingo. He would try to integrate the phrases and words into how to be more successful at the salon. He would also pitch to his clients. This used to be a guy who was lots of fun, and when you saw him for a haircut, you could just bullshit with him. Now, he's preaching to every single client who sits in his chair. He's even lost people, but is totally oblivious to it. He doesn't think it's him! For Christmas, we all received positive thinking books. He would also try to lure new employees into this crap. I felt to greasy and creepy after reading your story!
Subject: Amway vs. others Wed, 28 Oct 1998 I am not/will never be in Amway (just so you know), but I think Network Marketing can be very lucrative. I visited your website and found it very interesting. I was wondering if you feel the same way about all Network Marketing companies or just Amway. Why?/Why not? Is there a Network Marketing company (that you know of) that is a solid business?
Subject: Loved your Amway story Thu, 29 Oct 1998 Just got done reading it. You hit the nail on the head. I was recently approached by a co-worker who offered to tell me about an "excellent business opportunity". When he wouldn't tell me what it was, I became instantly suspicious. After a meeting with him and his upline, I was pretty convinced that it was either a pyramid scheme or Amway (I later realized that it was both). They claimed their company was called "Britt Worldwide". A search on the net brought up a document about - you guessed it - Amway. Britt Worldwide is just some guy named Britt who got big enough to "split off" from Amway, but he's doing and selling the same stuff. I got a bunch of information off the internet, both pro and con, for Amway. I was considering doing a little infiltration into the meetings myself until I read your story. Now I'm thinking "Why bother. They'll be ready for all my questions anyway". Besides, it's not worth my time and effort. But thanks alot for your story. These people are dangerous, and I believe everyone should investigate Amway before getting involved. Great page, and keep up the good work.
Subject: Your Amway page... Sat, 31 Oct 1998 Russ: I have to tell you , as of, Monday I was going to cancel the internet . Going through my bookmarks I came upon MLM scams, one last time, looking down the list, Amway struck a note it"s been around for years. Thinking what scam could they be doing I've never heard of any bad reports about them but who knows. Hitting up your home page and reading the letters and responces I never laughed so hard. Whether you started out to be funny or simple gallows humor I don"t have a clue, but, I think your on to something . Ever try stand-up . Keep it up pal, looking forward to reading more of you comments, peace
Subject: Your Amway story (part 1) Sat, 31 Oct 1998 Not an insult but just a note. Sounds like you've been minipulated alright. I think if I'd had that experience I'd have felt the same but you must have hooked up with the wrong crowd alright because WORLD WIDE DREAM BUILDERS has a different "technique". Call Amway directly some day and ask who are the real producer systems. World Wide has a much higher performance and retention rate because of the WAY we build our networks . . . based on personal use and retail we do better than any other Amway system by over 37%. Check THAT out if you CAN. We look for people who are LOOKING and the FIRST thing we do is find out what they know about Amway. You were obviously deceived and manipulated . . . "like ME right?" Well anyway if you spent as much time looking at alternative systems as you did EXPLAINING your story you might be SURPRISED that there are REAL Amway businesses out there that are profitable and are not based on deception. It was an interesting ESPOSE on what NOT to do though . . . Thanks! making it work in Toronto
Subject: Your Amway page Tue, 3 Nov 1998 Well done and well said. Pretty amazing isn't t just how many people have been fooled and continue to be fooled. I think though now because of the readily available info out there on Amway via the Internet, it has been a contributing factor to their declining growth. Best of success to you! Regards, **** Why USANA? Because it's a great financial opportunity? Yes that's true, but also because the true measure of a life is not in riches gained... but in how many lives were enriched along the way!
Subject: My Amway story Wed, 04 Nov 1998 Mr. Glasser, I appreciate your displeasure with the "Amway opportunity". I was once an Amway distributor. I joined and quit in 1993. I joined for a dream and quit because it all seemed so forced, so fake. However... I am a distributor again. And I'll tell you why. I had my faith in God long before the "business". I need no one else to force me to believe. If it is His will that I succeed (or not) than it will be so. My experience with the "business" has been pleasant. I honestly feel that the product quality is at least equal to that of other brands. I have received all the usual encouragement to buy books, tapes and to attend seminars. I usually don't. Thats my choice. But my upline is still good to me and my wife. As for the books, tapes and seminars? I have always known who makes how much at what level. Its no secret in our organization. And I can talk to my upline about things other than Amway without being expelled from the Amway realm. They really are my friends. My sponsor was my friend long before the "business". Naive? Maybe. Greedy. Hardly. I have my material goodies. I know the value of hard work and investing smart. I have a comfortable life, but I want more for my wife and daughter. And I firmly believe that I didn't sell out to do it. You can disagree if you wish. Your experience with the Amway business was unfortunate, and certainly not unique. I see or hear such stories often. Some distributors are entirely too human in their weaknesses. They will do and say anything to sponsor a "prospect". (When you think about that, its really dumb. Any relationship, business included, based on lies, is bound to fail). Please take heart that we Amway people are not all bad. Bad people are just that: Bad people. Their line of work rarely matters, its all in the application of it.
Subject: Finished your Amway story...
Wed, 4 Nov 1998
Russell,
what are you doing writing my story?? Ha ha. Almost word for word,
this happened to me, only I bought the starter package and paid for one
meeting at a hotel. I'm printing your entire story for to save a "FREIND"
(before he makes a mistake) who is being actively recruted by the same guy
that got me "IN" (only for about a month before I realized that these guys
were stupid). LOVED YOUR STORY thank you for taking the time to print it!!!!
Yours truley,
Fellow Loser
Subject: Your Amway page... Wed, 04 Nov 1998 This request for an opinion on selling sent in to Miss Manners column about MLM (from Boston Globe, October 27, 1998): Dear Miss Manners: My husband and I are rather outgoing and have a wide circle of friends and acquaintances. Frequently, someone will notice my husband's "people skills" and success in business sales, and will approach him to meet for lunch. The pretext is always friendship; sometimes the wives befriend me also. Usually these people are in multilevel marketing and want to recruit my husband for their business. We have grown frustrated with people who put on a show of friendship but have a hidden profit motive. After their offer is turned down, we never hear from them again. Similarly, I am often invited by close friends to a "party" at which some product will be sold. Since I don't want to hurt their feelings, I do not tell them my opinion of such attempts to convert friends into customers, and I always beg off from the party with some excuse. But I am amazed they would enter into a business where every friend is seen as a potential contact or moneymaker for them. I would like your opinion on these situations. Gentle Reader: Miss Manners has been railing on for years about the unpleasantness and anger of disguising commerce as friendship, and the problem only seems to be getting worse. She doesn't worry only about those who, like you, are annoyed to be trapped by people who fool you into thinking they like you when they only want to extract an extra buck or a business advantage; she worries about them, too. They may feel smug now about using social trappings to soften people up or embarrass them into commercial compliance, but they will be less so when they need friends and are left only with those who are as calculating as they about what's in it for them.
I've always said Miss Manners kicks ASS.
Subject: Amway related URLS Wed, 4 Nov 1998 Here are some of the URLs Canadian distributors use. I have noticed that in the states there is much more negative about Amway. A lot of what I've read is unheard of in Canada. I don't even know where you are so I might be wrong about you not being in Canada. I really don't understand what it ia all about (the negative) and I do know how it works (Amway). Oh well, here are the links.... I do not know if you should post them with out contacting their respective owners so just check them out and contact them to see. Casey Combden. Executive Diamond. These are HIS websites. http://www.CEI-Interactive.com (has the profiles of success for Combden Enterprises. It's a brag-site for the people Casey has helped. I would ask for permission here.) http://www.CEI-Tech.com (you need passwords to log in... It's for the tech crew. I would ask for permission here.) Internet Services Corporation. This is the corp. that provides the tapes, books, and functions. Started by Dexter Yager BEFORE he got rich. http://www.Internet-Services.com (passwords: dream, big. I think you can post this one all you want.) Amway of Canada. http://www.Amwayca.com (set up in and for Canadian distributors. I think you can post this one all you want.) http://www.Amway-abn.com (a tool for distributors to help run their businesses. I think you can post this one all you want.) I would like to hear from you regarding what you have learned/seen from these sites. Also let me know what the results were of your asking them if they mind you posting their URLs. Good luck.
Subject: thanx for all your research Wed, 4 Nov 1998 I dont have time to do the research myself as u have, other than web searching other peoples research. Maybe I am biased towards the anti amway/mlm articles because they are so compelling and it is funny how they have so much more to say than the pro ones! The anti articles are so much longer and thorough, hmmm, I wonder why that is! LOL! Anyhow, I was suddenly being treated as a good "friend" by a coworker I hardly know. My life experience, altho I am still young at 26, has told me that I just don't make friends overnite! Next day I get this phone call and she cuts right to the chase, but she won't tell me its Amway. I coaxed that info out of another coworker. I was wondering what prompted you to do this research. Did it come from personal involvement? I have looked over some of the pro mlm pages, not too many I admit, but I'm hoping to feel that I was justified in making accusations against her and having reported this to our boss at work because the anti Amway articles seem not only more numerous, but more compelling. Most people, I assume, had nothing to gain by spending the time and energy on a web page such as yours except satisfying the urge to protect and warn others. My coworker seemed nice and I'm just trying to not feel bad for going behind her back and telling our boss that she is propositioning coworkers and that maybe its an inappropriate use of her job.
Subject: Your Amway page... Wed, 4 Nov 1998 Hello Russell, My name is *****, I am on the verge of considering amway as a business venture. I have been hyped by these guys and consider it a challenge. After reading your page(s) I am now questionable. I was wondering if you could let me know about where else to go to find out info. I've been told that if I don't like it within the first year that I can get a full refund of my "entry fee". I cannot seem to find this type of info out. thanks.
Subject: My reply to your Amway page Thu, 5 Nov 1998 Dear Sir: Thank you for a most enjoyable read???? I''d been successful in three "traditional" businesses before embarking on our Amway business. I'm happy to report to you and all your readers that we can now make it a 4th successful "nontraditional" business. We decided to take our Amway business as serious as our first three businesses (which all sold for a significant profit). In reading most of your negative replies, I really got a kick out of how many said they "investigated" the "Real Truth" web sites. Not many of them probably visited all the REAL AMWAY sites. It would be great if people could admit their shortcomings and not try to justify them at the expense of other peoples dreams. In the real world when critics(a.k.a., our competition) of our other 3 businesses tried to bring us down with negative rumors it never worked because the AVERAGE consumer could see that it was a smoke screen to cover our competition's own inferiority's. Unfortunately the AVERAGE person would never admit these truths when it comes to failing at an Amway business because the AVERAGE person doesn't realize it will always take an ABOVE AVERAGE effort to become UN-AVERAGE. The facts speak for themselves. Amway is a MULTIBILLION $$$$ business that operates legally in 75+ Countries and Territories. Amway networks with 1000+ companies. What "REAL TRUTH" has Amway been able to hide from 75+ governments and 1000+ companies? Regardless how much money is made on the TOOL income(which is available to everyone who doesn't QUIT) Amway's annual sales figures ARE BASED ON VOLUME. So you really do make a sizable "Amway" income when you build your business correctly. It's to bad that Amway doesn't charge $25,000 to start a business! I'm sure that would have kept out most of the "Future Jerry Springer Guests," but that's what makes Amway special, the AVERAGE person can start a business. Unfortunately for the AVERAGE person it does take work to really succeed at anything in life. YES, EVEN AMWAY!!!!!!!
Subject: Finished your Amway story... Thu, 05 Nov 1998 Mr. Glasser: Good luck to you too. I hope that you do succeed in your endeavors. Please realize that not all of your experience is universal to Amway. I have been a distributor for years, and while I must admit that I have not YET achieved substantial monetary profit, the association within my line of sponsorship has been VERY worthwhile to me. I wonder if you are still as cynical as you were back in the mid-90s, when (apparently) you had your Amway experience. I wonder how successful your "40-40 plan" efforts have been for you. You are obviously an intelligent and articulate person. I suspect you have had some good initial success in the world of business. Above I made an oblique reference to differences within the "world of Amway." My point is...that you should realize that just as not all doctors or lawyers or politicians are the same or even similar, so too, not all Amway lines of sponsorship are the same. You clearly have a very high opinion of your own intellect, feeling that you can clearly see, based on a few weeks experience, what many thousands of others don't. But MAYBE some of them have seen some things in their months and years of experience that you haven't. Think about it. And think about whether you're still so sure of your own perspective to be certain you are doing the world a service by posting your conclusions on this web site. Or are you perhaps just massaging your ego?
The second one, definitely.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 3) Thu, 05 Nov 1998 Your story is pretty intense!!! My name is Dan Dougherty and I'm trying to gather information about Amway and based on your story I know your point of view. I was approached by a gentleman I met through a job interview(I didn't take their job offer), anyways, he called me about a week later to get an update on the job. I told him that I accepted another job. He didn't have a problem with it and he mentioned, by the way, would you be interested in pursuing an endeavor outside of work. To make a long story short, I meet him for lunch, got a quick scoop of things and met him at a meeting that night. It was pretty interesting... he gave me some information(tapes/video) to look over and set up a meeting for a couple of days later. The meeting is actually today and with the research I've been doing and your website, I'm definetly turned off on this whole thing. Any more insight you can send my way would be great "Almost Suckered"
Subject: Your Amway page... Thu, 05 Nov 1998 ..... is absolutely fantastic !!! My 77 year old mother has been an Amway distibutor for over 30 years. DO I HAVE STORIES !!!! But, my blood pressure goes up whenever I start thinking or talking about it. She is still in "the business" and is destitute. When she comes to visit at Xmas I have to tell her that she has to file bankruptcy. Not looking forward to the holidays ! Anyway, a friend I've met on the Internet is thinking of getting involved with a company called Market America USA. From my experience, I would discourage my worst enemy from getting involved in any multi-level marketing company. I advised her to research the net simply by typing Amway Scamway to gain a little education. I have been searching for "negative" info regarding Market America unsuccessfully. Do you have any familiarity or information that I can pass on to her? Thanks in advance. Maybe one day I'll tell some of my stories.
Subject: WHY IS THERE EVEN A DEBATE??? Fri, 06 Nov 1998 Dear Sir: I have already sent some (juicy) mail agreeing about what scum are the Amaroids. I was NEVER involved. I first saw the plan when I was a teenager, and although feeling a bit of adrenaline over the possibility of "instant riches" I saw it as a fine and luxurious automobile lacking an engine. There was nothing to substantiate the claims.... So 20 years later as a homeowner, I have been in the habit of renting out a room to make a few extra nickels. Unfortunately, the last 2 years were to people who got involved in Amway. Two years later, I finally threw them all out into the street. Thank God! No more little Am-bar wrappers from their $3 Amway Candy Bars. No more Am-juice in the refrigerator (a 25 cent pack of Koolaid sold for $$$). No more "Amway" cardboard boxes stacked into the corners of the house from their products that they ream themselves with. No more pestering me that "although I have a house, I could lose everything, unless....!!!" Anyway, why is there even a debate? Your web site is about debate, right? Look at the mail, one guy says "it sucks", the other says "young man, you are very young, and what do you know about this fine business that is #24 on the Fortune 500, etc. etc. etc." Well, I'll tell you why there is a debate. The Am-piggies are liars!!!!!! They say this crap about "We are the #2 producer of millionaires in the United States, etc. etc." and of course, that causes honest people to become quiet and reconsider whether perhaps they are mistaken. The problem??? They are a bunch of liars! Some Amaroid actually said in the mail that Amway is #24 on the Fortune 500 list????? That's a show stopper, but get on your search engine and get a list of the top 500 companies, and it just ain't there, folks!!!!!!! The reason that Amway exists is because they are all a bunch of lying cheating, thieving, scummy, worthless, mentally disturbed FREAKS. When they start to win the argument by saying "Amway produces the most millionaires", "Amway is in the Fortune 500", don't back down, just call them the liars that they are. There is nothing boastful or proud about these scuzzy, scuzzy people. In the end what disgusted me most was how they envied me. I have worked 12 years straight and level, in the old job grind, and as a consequence I have a small, poorly maintained home in the 'burbs, two decent automobiles, and a pile of savings in the bank, and some corporate stocks also. Is that so awesome??? NO! But they were jealous, jealous, jealous and they always failed to conceal their envy. And as Am-piggies, they also saw me, who had SOMETHING (my small suburban home with moss on the roof) as this TARGET. And they could never quit targeting me, until I finally threw them all out, with all their lying cult-culture with them. YAH! FEELS GREAT! There is no debate to have with these liars.
Subject: WHEN WILL YOU POST MY STUFF?? Fri, 06 Nov 1998 Dear Rglasser: When will you post the mail that I sent? I think you are forgetting. Also, what about a "condensed" page that has only the juiciest mail?? A reply appreciated. Hallelujah to the Anti-Amway brigade. I never agreed to worship Jesus Amway. I only worship Jesus Christ. These freaks with their cult have a whole new religion.
Here is your post, a mere 8 months later. I hope you're happy now.
Subject: Worldwide Dreambuilders Fri, 6 Nov 1998 I did a search on the web for Worldwide Dreambuilders after an acquaintance told me about a wonderful opportunity with this name. My immediate reaction was AMWAY. I have nothing personal against Amway or any other MLM. I'm just not interested. Your's was the only page that came up in my search. Thanks.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 2) Fri, 06 Nov 1998 Thank you for your story. I agree with everything I have read so far. I wish I
Subject: Links2Go Key Resource Award Mon, 9 Nov 1998 Congratulations! Your page: http://www.willynet.com/rglasser/amway/ has been selected to receive a Links2Go Key Resource award in the Amway topic! The Links2Go Key Resource award is both exclusive and objective. Fewer than one page in one thousand will ever be selected for inclusion. Further, unlike most awards that rely on the subjective opinion of "experts," many of whom have only looked at tens or hundreds of thousands of pages in bestowing their awards, the Links2Go Key Resource award is completely objective and is based on an analysis of millions of web pages. During the course of our analysis, we identify which links are most representative of each of the thousands of topics in Links2Go, based on how actual page authors, like yourself, index and organize links on their pages. In fact, the Key Resource award is so exclusive, even we don't qualify for it (yet ;)! Please visit: http://www.links2go.com/award/Amway to find out more about this award, and to download graphics if you wish to display this award on your page. Once again, congratulations on your award! Links2Go Awards awards@links2go.com P.S. If you are not the author or maintainer of this page, please accept our appologies. We would appreciate it if you would forward this email to the appropriate person.
Hey, I'm listed on yet another search engine. Let me break out the champagne.
Subject: Sorry you didn't get to meet with real people... Tue, 10 Nov 1998 Hi Russell, Like my tag line said, sorry you didn't get to meet with real people in your experience with Amway...but sounds to me like you have since your crusade has begun. Like you, I get fed up with some of the lolly-gagging that goes on in this business. My wife and I have been distributors for some time, but have never devoted "serious" time in creating this into a business venture of substantiation until recently, and quite frankly, I have not been met with a tremendous amount of success. But I have my own hurdles to leap over and day by day I manage to get over them, both in and out of this business. But like you, probably the one thing that grates on me is the "cloning" effect that a marketing group, which is not Amway, has on many individuals...until you get to know one, or two, or many others. All of us, for the most part, have jobs, rent or a mortgage, a dog that mostly manages to poop outside, and troubles of our own on top of the additional effort to create a substantial business. But I would ask you to answer a few questions... Where does a single mother, who works full time and raises two children, who has no business degree or any other degree, go when she wants to raise herself out of the $10.00/hr existence she finds herself in? How many kids go to college knowing that they are more than likely going to drop out, fail out, or be kicked out of college? What about all the money they have spent and time spent not living up to the standards of a college? My first, second, and fourth roomates were examples of that, and neither of them have ever returned to finish their "education". Their tuition money is long gone, and their lives are not substantially improved. Oh sure, if they spend the money now ( where does that come from) and the time (a little more than hobby level....i'm sure), they could get the sheepskin and find a (another) job, but how much different is that to building a business like an Amway distributorship? It's been said that the average college graduate will have jobs in 7 different fields, only one of which will be in the doctrine studied. Time, Newsweek, US News and World Report, and Wall Street Journals have articles in the last year pointing out this statistic. Most people don't know where they might land a job, and as long as it pays, most don't care. For many distributors, and most of us "Generation X-ers", we have to accept the fact that the days of getting a job, and staying gainfully employed in that field, and even with the same employers, is a ship that is well out to sea. So why not Amway....hell, it just might work? And if it doesn't, you'll blend right in with the other college educated computer programming majors dressed up in tuxedo's scanning my HollyWood Video rental choices, or framing my house, or cooking my fajita's at Chili's, or who owns the landscaping company that does my yard, or who are the real estate agents that sold me my house. Life pays you for what you are good at, at the level of your expertise and value to both the company and the customer. It's too bad that good people get a bum rap and bad people seem to prosper. And it's too bad that Amway people wear suits, else otherwise you might mistake them for real people.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 3) Mon, 9 Nov 1998 hi russell, thanks for posting your story on the web, i've been approach by a Amscamer also, infact last week. all that yuo have said is ture, Thank you soo much for helping me make up my mind about this subject
Subject: A TRUE AMWAY STORY FROM A FRIEND Tue, 10 Nov 1998 My favorite "happening" re Amway was when a neighbor asked to come over to discuss "something important" and ended up trying to sell Amway products. He asked for a glass and propped a Styrofoam cup inside the glass, and then poured Amway drain cleaner in it. He proudly proclaimed the worth of the product as it ate through the Styrofoam cup in a minute or so. He also set up a duplicate demo with Draino, which did nothing to the Styrofoam cup. I thought about that for a few seconds and then set up my own demo using two funnels, each of which I clogged with Crisco cooking fat. The Draino cleaned the fat out of the funnel in about 3 minutes, while the Amway drain cleaner did nothing, for the rest of the time it took me to get the neighbor to go home (maybe 30 minutes). As he left (still convinced that I had done something tricky) I told him that "if I ever get my drains clogged up with Styrofoam I'll be sure to buy his product".
Subject: Re. Amway
Wed, 11 Nov 1998
Thought I would drop you a line, to thank you for your view on Amway.
Recently my wifes cousins came to stay with us for a evening. They had a
meeting to attend and travelled 3 hours to get here. They also mentioned
they wanted to talk about a buisness oportunity. We should have my wifes
brother come over for breakfast to listen to this one in a lifetime
chance. Well we listened to the sales pitch, admittedly were some what
interested. We received the catalogue, then we realized it was AMWAY. I
instantly started searching the net, research. I'm not one to make quick
decisions with out thought and information.
Well I guess in the days to come I'm going to have to let our cousins
know what I think. I have decided to tell them staight. There is more to
life than joing a cult, full of false hopes and promises.
Unfortunately it's too late for them. Amway has them "hook, line and
sinker". Only after one month, this guy thinks he'll be quiting a job
he's held for 27 years, in the very near future. To me they seemed like
perky zombies preaching the words of Amway. Sorry, "the buisness".
I gave my brother-in-law a hard copy of your article. He got a good
laugh. He thinks Amway is a pack of wolfes preying on the weak and sick.
Just Thought I'd Drop You a Line.
Thanks
P.S. 2 for Russell a.k.a. Lone Ranger
0 for Phil
Subject: MLM Wed, 11 Nov 1998 I have read your so called Amway experience. I have never been engaged in any kind of MLM and I donīt work for any companies involved in MLM. As far as I can read you donīt really have a point and you donīt have any proof, do you. Only a lot of things you make to be a proof. Like, alot of people are not succesful therefore MLM does not work. Is that a proof? You have every right to take a stand against MLM - but consider thatīs all you do. The way I understand your stuff itīs like you are saying "I know about MLM, I have proof". You donīt - only a personal experience and hear say - no proof. I donīt wat to defend MLM. I find MLM interesting and I am trying to find out about it. If theres anything wrong - like really wrong with MLMī, I would like to be convinced about that as much as I would like to be convinced, that MLM is the right thing to deal with. I have been searching the net for some real facts on MLM and thereīs non to be found. Only opinion makers like you. Some who just loves MLM and others who hate it. And it is all right - feel free to have what ever opinion you want. Just consider it might not be the truth about MLM. A car can kill people does that make the car bad and you not wanting to drive it? Just like with so many other new things here in life we are sceptic - and it is all right. But consider you donīt really know anything about MLM(just like me) and therefore your "true" experience with MLM is nothing but a made up truth to make you being right. Feel free to drop me a line and you have some real information on MLM that I can use in my quest to find the "truth" about MLM. Sincerely, *****, Denmark (I hope you can understand my english)
Subject: Finished your Amway story... Wed, 11 Nov 1998 Russell: Thank you, thank you, thank you! I'm being pressured by two people to join an organization called Network 21. They didn't tell me it was Amway until after I had met with them three times. They keep bugging me for a list of my friends, and frankly, I will never push this stuff on anyone I know. I am calling both of these people today and telling them that I want no part of their "international business opportunity." Thanks again,
Subject: OLD AMWAY STORY Wed, 11 Nov 1998 Dear Sirs: I knew some ambots for 2 years (got rid of them now, threw them out of my life) and of course I got all sharply educated on scAmway through web pages like yours, as part of the experience. So I know all about it now, but here's what's interesting, about fully 10 years ago, when I knew nothing of scAmway, I was dropping a parcel at the big U.P.S. freight terminal. They have a retail counter, you see. (and today, it's interesting what a phenomenon is Amway to the U.P.S. folks. The retail counter has quite a clog of Amway parcels from all the 'millionaires' and sometimes the clerk actually asks me "is your parcel for Amway?" That's here in 1998, probably for some sort of discount??? U.P.S. probably doesn't know whether to love 'em or hate 'em) Anyway, way back around 1989, some guy walked up to me in the parking lot and said "that's a very fine and clever bumper sticker you have on the back of the car". (Being a conservative Republican Christian, I think I had something on the back of the car about 'no Jesus no peace, Know Jesus Know Peace'). I said "oh thanks I don't have any more of those stickers, I can tell you where I got it". He said "oh no that's OK, by the way, are you off to work right now?" "yes, yes, I just stopped to drop my parcel, are you a Christian also??" He said "Yes absolutely I'm with **** evangelical baptist (or some such)" and almost immediately then he said "listen, you are going to work, but think how weary it makes you. Imagine if you could do something separately from your job, that would make you lots of extra money, would that interest you??" I said "gee, no, it wouldn't because my job takes up all my time. I find that with my extra errands, shopping for groceries, and fixing the car, that there is no time left over after I finish that 40 hours and take care of laundry & stuff". He said "what if the pay was really good, and it was only, say, about 10 hours extra per week?" (I am an electrical engineer so I am quite logical, so my answers are very logical also). I said "no, it wouldn't interest me, because I just said I use up ALL my time with the job I have. I don't have ANY extra hours when the week is over." He said "but not even if the extra money is really good??" I said "when I looked for my job, I found the best salary that I could find. That is where I make my money, it is the best money I can hope for, and I want to be of service to my supervisor that hired me." He went on a few times more "even if the money is good, just 10 hours per week??" and I kept replying with the exact same logical replies that my job was my best deal, and I had NO extra time when I was done with the job (the gospel truth actually, how much time, after errands, is really left? And that's your quality hours, your "relaxation hours", those last few hours, they are not "amway hours". So I was very polite yet logical, so he went away!!!!! Although, he asked for my phone number incase I changed my mind, and I believe I was so gracious and logical that I gave it to him. About 6 weeks later, I did receive a call, to which I gave him the exact same logical responses. I was 23, and the guy looked to be about 33. Looked very professional, and I knew nothing of Amway, nor did he mention it. But here I am 10 years later, and I know ALL ABOUT Amway because of the Ambots I have booted out of my life more recently. And it sure makes me think back to the time at that U.P.S. parking lot, with that dude, and his persistent queries, and my logical responses. Now, I can see it all so clearly!!! He never said Amway, but what do you think HE was busy mailing at the U.P.S terminal??? L.O.C. to his "downline" no doubt. And did I always remember that encounter, because it was all so peculiar (like twilight zone) there at the U.P.S. parking lot. (By the way, leftists should NOT think of Amaroids as representative of the economically conservative anti-socialism anti-immorality people. Amaroids have no brains in their heads or their butts. But political conservatives (and some Christians) are actually quite intelligent. That's why I despise ambots, you see. By the way, after 10 years of working that lousy job, saving my nickels, clipping coupons, and * drum roll * learning about the corporate stock certificates, I now have a net worth of approximately $280,000. Not bad for age 33. In fact, it doesn't really buy me much. I live in a small cheap house, I invest as best I can, I mow my own grass, and so on. But it is the fruit of the JOB I had, and it's better than nothing, and it's what that the guy in the parking lot wanted to talk me out of, just so he could ream me on a few tapes and 10 years later if I'd done it his way then I would have nothing.
Subject: your amway page... Thu, 12 Nov 1998 Last night I was introduced to an Amway meeting. My few ignorant questions about delivery costs, using internet commerce instead of meetings and books and a few other items appeared to be met with frowns of concern rather than full understanding of how it all works. So this morning first light I've been doing some research. My current question is: "How can I get my tapes and books sold by the Amway sales team and be a paid speaker at their seminars and conferences?" . I would like to hear your experiences and comments in reply to this. Many thanks,
Subject: Ginny's Amway story (part 3) Wed, 11 Nov 1998 Dear Ginny, My second oldest brother Cliff was involved with Amway. He doesnt talk about it, ever. When he first graduated from college he wanted wealth and luxury. He was always a bit of a salesman so it was fairly easy for someone to eye him as a prospect. I don't know what his ephinany was. I do know that he leave Amway with some rather harsh words. A couple years of his life thrown aside, money from the other jobs he maintained while he hit it big gone. Well, he didn't learn his lesson all the way and got involved in a few other multi level marketing career choices. There were tapes and tapes and tapes everywhere. He would say, "Mark, do you want to be a sheep or a rhino?" "A sheep, Cliff, Baaaa baaaaa." I would drive him nuts making sheep noises at odd times. Well, he finally cleared out of the MLM altogether. And put his talents of pitching to good use promoting worthwhile software and hardware products to video stores to cover their inventory. Next thing you know this becomes a business for him and grows, and ten years later his company is producing just software. A few more years and he has to hire professional head hunters to bring in the right people. He lives a bit on the edge lining up one investor after the other for his software company. But with 20 employees and other firms involved as partners it is not exactly a garage business. He does just fine in the long run. And I dont mention Amway or bleet like a sheep out of politeness.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 2) Wed, 11 Nov 1998 Dear Mr. Glasser, I read much of your story of your experience with an Amway organization that is not like the groups I have worked with over the years. My wife and I have been distributers for twenty eight years and the association with the corporation and the line of sponsorship and the exposure to life changing attitudes is nothing like the experience you described. For years we have struggled to overcome the image of the business you portray in your website. I do believe your observations as to what you experienced is accurate from stories I have heard about "systems" within the Amway organization, but they are not all like the one you described. Amway is made up of several million people and those people and their organizations are as different from one another as the religions of the world. You can't judge them all by your experience with one. I am not saying that your evaluation of groups other than the one you were exposed to would be much different, however, some groups are more aggressive on sales of books, tapes and seminars than others. I imagine the responses you get give you great satisfaction and you feel like you are saving the world. It boils down to the fact that only people who are looking for a reason not do the business will find your site and those who are looking for hope will not find it. Believe it or not, in my almost thirty years of exposure to the Amway business, I can tell you countless stories of people who have exceeded in the business and in life. The amazing thing is that friends of mine who were exposed to the positive attitude taught at seminars and in books and tapes over several years and applied those principles to their life, achieved greater success than if they had not been in the business. One friend hit 7500 PV one month years ago and maintained a business at about the 1500 level for about three years, never made a lot of money in the business but did make enough to cover expenses. His full time job was selling for a restaurant supply business. His company downsized and he lost his job. Because of the attitudes learned in Amway, he had the courage to organize and start his own restaurant supply business. A few years later (about 1976) he, a neighbor, and two other friends in various restaurant related jobs each put up $10,000 and started the first Hacienda Restaurant in Mishawaka, IN. They expanded to a regional chain with about eight restaurants and last year, they sold the business and each partner received several million dollars each. My friend over the years fervently supports the Amway business and attributes what he learned in the business as the reason for his success. This is true for me also. I am a successful telecommunications consultant and have had my own practice for fourteen years. Without the attitudes learned from my exposure to the Amway business, I would be working in the stressful world of Corporate life and probably would have been downsized by now. Your belief in what your doing is wonderful from your perspective. I assure you that if you keep one person from the experience of my wife and I have had for most of our thirty one years of marriage and my multi-millionaire friend, you will be doing a terrible disservice to the world.
Subject: Finished your Amway story... Thu, 12 Nov 1998 You have proved them all wrong, count me in as one of the many that your story has saved. Somehow everything I read here echoed a nagging voice I had in the back of my mind, now It's a loud laughing voice saying "See, I told you so." You won't believe how close to joining I was. The important word here is was. Thanks.
Subject: Great info, Geek Thu, 12 Nov 1998 I have enjoyed ruffling through your pages this afternoon. I must admit, I too was fooled by the promises of the Amway "opportunity". I a over that now and my friends have even become my friends again. On the amway subject, my direct sponsor was one of the "emeralds" that have sued Yager and Amway here in Texas over the tools business that Amway has become. He is no longer an "Amwaydavidian" (a term we coined when we were in '93-'95). His vast financial wealth is concentrated in rent houses now. He is ashamed and can hardly look people in the eyes that he sponsored. He should be ashamed because he was making big bucks off the System. Your personal page is great and I am encouraging my 17 y.o. son to take a look tonight as he also shares your love for computer games. He desparately wants to be a programmer some day and you would be his hero. Of course, I was an original Pong player. I spent hours playing those early games and now my son and I play the new ones ( he kills me everytime) ( and I am really trying hard). I have rambled too long so keep up the good work and welcome to Texas. I hope you and Ginny are doing well.
Subject: What else - Amway Fri, 13 Nov 1998 Hello there Writing fron Australia where Amway and another wannabee (Omegatrend) company have found some resistance from people who think the same as you. I found your page whilst searching for something completely different, but with the same keywords. I found your story very, very, very real. NOT because of the events, but rather because of the absolutely truthful way you seem to convey your feelings. I must admit that I have a similar minset - including the nervously planned desire to bring down such a fiasco. I reall appreciated 'being there'. I am NOT an avid reader nor writer but the impressions you conveyed has cleared up any small doubt in the integrity of Amway. I was caught in something called 'Holliday Magic' many years ago (a mixture of Avon and Amway really). I especially savoured your conclusion, and whilst you too nervous to be cock-sure it would all work, I appreciate your honest and explanation. I will be using it to warn others in the Amway organisation. Once again - thank you for spending the time and effort to place it on the internet. Regards, Perth Australia 32 degrees Centergrade, warm winds, shower or two today.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 2) Fri, 13 Nov 1998 no flame i feel sorry for you
Subject: RE: Amway brainwashing
Mon, 16 Nov 1998
Dear Russell,
What a relief to read your Amway story. Yesterday I was visited by an
ex-work college, who arrived at the doorstep with her husband, dressed in a
conservative suit. The previous night she phoned to talk to us (my husband
and I) about "something". We were both intrigued to find out what this
important "something" was!
The usual routine occurred, short chit chat about life, money etc. He then
pulled out his blank paper and pen and began talking about his dream of
starting the ideal business. Such an easy plan, which would eventually end,
in an early retirement for the both of us, with the bonus of a continual
cash flow.
Throughout the 2 hours, when our attention seemed to wander, they would
would return to our list of goals and ambitions. Encouraging us to dream
bigger and better!!! What a joke.
To conclude the meeting, I asked to have a copy of the Amway catalogue,
which to my suprise, they didn't have available at the time. They did
however leave us with the 'Network video', 2 motivational tapes and the 'How
To Build Your Network' booklet.
This booklet, states: "Don't give them a copy of the catalogue to take
away. You want them to focus on what they would do with the money, not the
product details" How can someone think about planning a business if they
haven't even seen the products!!
The booklet also writes: "Teach people to teach people to teach
* I'm a winner
* I'm a leader
* I'm an achiever
* I believe in me
* I can do all things through Christ
who strengthens me."
Does that mean I can't join the business if I am a Muslim, Hindu etc? And
dont they say money is the route of all evil? Next they will be telling us
a Comet is coming to earth to rescue us all and we all have to shave our
heads and commit suicide, covering ourselves with shawls and enough spare
change in our pockets to pay the driver! Ha Ha!
If the above doesn't sound like a cult, then what does?
Anyway, the more I read the booklet, the less I am able to comprehend how my
two supposedly intelligent mid 20 year old could be such suckers.
She is due to ring me tomorrow, and I know what I'm going to say to her!
Thank you so much for all your information, wishing you all the best in your
business. Keep up your good work.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 3) Sun, 15 Nov 1998 Hey I just wanted to say thank you for your story it helped me make a very wise decision to not join the business. Thanks again.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 2)
Sun, 15 Nov 1998
To whom it may concern,
Without question you have had a bad experience with an individual
not the Amway Corporation. Independent Amway distributors that have
experience and knowledge of the truth offend people like yourself and
so many others because the majority of people dont like hearing the
truth. This business makes people look in the mirror and for many
they dont like what they see. The only way to succeed in this
business is by helping others reach there goals first. Amway stands
for integrety, honor and committment. Many people lack these three
things in there lives so they will take there non productive time and
print such garbage as your webpage. By reading between the lines its
quite obvious why you didnt become an amway distributor. There are
more multi- millionaires and people who have reached finacial security
in this business the the top ten corporations in this world
combined. Im 28 years of age and I had already been in the top 5%
income bracket in this country befor Amway. SO BEFOR YOU TALK BAD
ABOUT AMWAY TAKE A LOOK AT YOUR PERSONAL SITUATION FIRST, THOUGH IM
SURE ITS PROBABLY QUITE PAINFUL. BUT THE GOOD NEWS IS THAT YOU DONT
HAVE TO BE 90 DAYS FROM BANKRUPTSY AND FINANCIAL DISTRESS ON A DAILY
BASIS BECAUSE AMWAY GIVES EVERYONE A CHANCE AND THATS MORE THEN I CAN
SAY FOR ALL THE FORTUNE 500 COMPAANYS COMBINED.
BEST WISHES,
Subject: amway Sun, 15 Nov 1998 Hi Russell, I have admired your site for quite a while. I am an inactive distributor of six years. I also happen to be employed by an amway diamond for the past four years. My husband and i personally sponsered over 28 people. I want you to know that I have been around the business for a while and know what is going on. My question to you is, has anyone ever spoke of the artistry sessions? I myself attended one last year and it was the reason I got out. I havent read any info on this and just wanted to know if you know anything. Thank you for your time. Keep up the good work.
Subject: great story Russell! Tue, 17 Nov 1998 hi Russell, I am a newbie in Amway. I have joined on three separate occasions, about 6 years apart eachtime, under three different up lines. The people were all friends, none bar the latest are now.... :-( Amway is soooo clever aren't they. They always took advantage of our financial situation, I was always dead broke at the time. In fact the second guy actually paid for my start up kit. How desperate is that! I never ever tried to recruit anyone. I joined to get the guys off my back. It became embarrassing when I did not get to any meetings, or buy product, or sell product, and the friendship dwindled almost on par with the business pressure! Your story is very interesting, although it proves very little... I know all you say is true, but you must admit it is only your word against the pressure and manipulation of a whole mass. Good on you though for going through with your promise to Phil . I bet he was freaked out, almost as much as you! Even though you were found out and set up, it still makes me smile at the end cause in a way YOU WON! Well this is just a bit of a ramble... I just wanted to say....good on ya! Thanx for the info! Qld Australia
Subject: Your Amway story (part 2) Thu, 19 Nov 1998 Hi Russell, As an apprentice acolite, (I've only shelled out Ģ15 for a function), and in all honesty would probably have spent more in the bar during the afternoon involved. (o.k DEFINITELY ), but a quick stroll through your site has just jammed me into reverse. The idea of an engineer failing to do some basic maths (I had overlooked the cost of the promo gear) means I currently feel a right pillock. I'm definitely not wasting a cent more on THAT scam, so thanks for injecting some objectivity. I had already noticed some heavy evangalistic overtones coupled with veiled Tammy Wynette syndrome, and being a natural cynic, am a bit worried that my natural alarm bells failed to go off. The more I think about it, the more I'm inclined to agree with the notion that the company I've seen pesented by yourself and quite a few others is mega-bad news. Pity, that as there are several positives to it, which would apply well in a non-brainwashing type setup. How do you reckon my putative upline will react to this? I think I'm going to break his heart - first thing tomorrow. Oh well, back to the drawing board...... Regards p.s. thanks for the reality check, keep up the good work
Subject: Your Amway story (part 3) Thu, 19 Nov 1998 Awsome story! I'm fascinated by the evils of Amway (never been in it but have heard second-hand about how weird they are). I especially loved the quote at the end of your story "The internet, hah! You'll never reach anybody that way." Ironically of course here I am, some average geek in Minneapolis working for a living in the IS industry who found your page through a search on cults and multi level networking. I rather like my job and seem to be doing alright at it, too. Way to go on your page! Keep up the good work.
Subject: Ginny's Amway story Fri, 20 Nov 1998 ...Actually, this is just to inform you of a new amway controversy site; http://207.201.180.19/amway which is an inviation for Amway leaders to respond to the criticisms etc. Should be interesting as time goes on.
Subject: Finished your Amway story... Fri, 20 Nov 1998 HEY I THINK U HAVE A GREAT PAGE. I ALMOST GOT CONNED INTO THE AMWAY GAME. RIGHT AFTER I GOT OUT OF THE ARMY I STAYED WITH A FRIEND IN NEW YORK WE WERE INVITED TO HIS FRIENDS HOUSE. THATS WHEN WE WERE TOLD ABOUT THIS GREAT WAY TO BECOME MILLIONARES IN A FEW YEARS. I AM GLAD I LISTENED TO MY SKEPTICISM. THE ONLY WAY TO BECOME RICH IN A FEW YEARS IS THE GOOD OLD STOCK MARKET NOT SOME INVERTED PYRAMID SCHEME. THE AMWAY CULT SHOULD BE TREATED JUST LIKE JIM JONES CULT.
Subject: Finished your Amway story... Mon, 23 Nov 1998 Great website and a good service. Keep it up. These guys(Amway) need a severe thrashing.,
Subject: Amway Wed, 25 Nov 1998 Hi my name is john(fake name). I just finished your informative Amway experience. Please note this following is my opinion only. and the reader should make up there own mind. I was also in this cultic business in the late 80's. My experience was not all that PROFITABLE either. The story is the same. I got suckered in to the business a x-friend. My down fall was Even though I was selling or pushing the amway line and doing about $100-$200 per month I saw $0.00 in revenue checks. Mostly due to my x-friend who never passed down the bonus checks. He saw the light before I did and bailed out of the Amway bus. I shortly followed. Not to say the whole system is corrupt. But would-be distributors be careful. If your personality is reserved this is not for you. If you think you can do this part-time and make a lot of money your dead wrong. Like you stated it takes up a lot of your time. To bring you up to date I have been asked to join a group called INA I forgot what it stands for. its looks to me as the same story with a new name. In other words its a splinter group of amway Diamonds who got together and started this org. the difference is this group is detected to the new Web based virtual mall that is scheduled to be released in Jan of 99. How it works Same as Amway you recruit people who in turn recruit people who recruit other people. just like Amway. The twist is you will be given two ID access numbers to the web mall. one is for your use (includes discount.)and the other you give out to people on a business card or something to get them to use the Internet. when the person uses your access number you get credit for the sales. I think I heard you get like 1/10 of a penny just for that person browsing the web pages. The other thing is there are a lot of companies who have jumped on board with lots of products. What I was told was amway is only one of the stores in the mall. and they also handle the distribution the other stores as well. MY Flags In talking to a person at one of those home meetings I had an alarm go off in my head. I was told I would have to spend about $40 a month in tapes and a $60-70 for a voice mail so I could be current with the latest going ons in the business. $100 a month is that I was told I would spend. The night befor I looked on the net for sights like yours. The web page pointed out that the company makes its money my getting you to buy the tapes and related stuff. I wish this was the dream come true. But I'm afraid it might turn into a nightmare the previous thas been my opinion onlY. If you have any commits please reply.
Subject: My reply to your Amway page Thu, 26 Nov 1998 Hi, It was recently suggested to me by my friend that he intends to expand his business and would like me to benefit. He had already made the necessary investments and only wanted outgoing, good couples like me and my wife. After a week and a meeting later I know now that it was the Amway business that he was talking about. This is in the Chicago area. I have heard a few motivational/informative tapes and read the literature and have had enough sessions with my friend. I almost like to believe what I 've heard. But it is too hard to believe that what took Bill Gates a lifetime to achieve can be achieved in a few years of part time work. I wanted to check out the facts and the Net is the place to go for multiple opinions on a topic. I came across your site and would like to know if you can lead me onto anything specific about the Chicago area chapter of this group. Thanks
Subject: Thank You!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thu, 26 Nov 1998 Thank you very much for creating this web site. I'm embarassed that I did not do any research before joiningAmway. It was only after joining that we went to the web for answers to the MANY questions and concerns we had that we learned THE TRUTH. Thank God we have only been involved for two weeks and had the foresight to see that Amway was coming between us. Our upline never told us involvement in Pro-Net was optional, That we should buy the tapes, books and go to seminars and conventions. It almost made us sick to our stomachs when we learned just how much almost everyone in our upline was making off all of the above. How is it that when you are "Shown the plan" no one mentions that 75% of the income they claim you can earn is from the profit of the sale of tapes, books and conventions in your "downline"! I would tell anyone who asks me to NEVER get involved with Amway. All of the so-called "salesman" in Amway who say the distributors who leave are "lazy" will probably see the light after their divorce, bankruptcy and at the gates of heaven are told by Peter "He has a great business opportunity for them, if they could just step into the elevator going down and listen to a short 13 minute tape".
Subject: YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT I KNOW Thu, 26 Nov 1998 WHAT DO YOU HAVE THAT IS BETTER? I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOUR SPONSOR TAUGHT YOU ABOUT BUYING PRODUCT BUT WE ARE TAUGHT IN WORLD WIDE THAT IF SOMETHING IS THAT MUCH MORE EXPENSIVE DON'T BUY IT. WE ARE SMART CONSUMERS AND TEACH OTHERS TO BE SMART CONSUMERS. I AM A 2500 PIN NOW AND APPROACHING 4000 AND YOU AND SOME EX-GIRLFRIEND CAN'T TELL ME THIS DOESN'T WORK. IF YOU PUT AS MUCH TIME INTO YOUR AMWAY BUSINESS AS YOU DID THIS WEB PAGE YOU WOULD BE A WEALTHY MAN AND PROBABLY HAVE a lot OF FRIENDS.
Subject: Your Amway page...
Fri, 27 Nov 1998
Your candor is admirable. People, particularly if they are intelligent,
often find it hard to admit they fell for a con. You've done a great
service here.
As a child I read a book about Amway's spiritual godfather, a Mr.
Ponzi, and was awe struck by the ingenuity of his scam. Needless to say
I can spot a pyramid a mile away. I hope I have saved my friends some $.
Seems these guys want you to believe you are too sorry to make it
without the plan, and when you still can't make it, it's because your
too damned sorry.
FYI, I am 44, retired (film production) and grateful to have had
the opportunity to have made my own mistakes, and won my own rewards. I
suppose that makes me a pitiful loser without the ability to dream. But
I can go fishing on weekday mornings.
Well, keep this page alive & well, it may save some people from a
bad time.
Best wishes for your success as well.
A-
If it be Life that awaits, I shall live forever unconquered: If Death, I
shall die at last strong in my pride and free.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 3) Fri, 27 Nov 1998 Friday, November 27, 1998 Thanks Russell: I've just spent six hours reading and absorbing your website, as well as related Amway sites. I was approached last Monday, and I've already been to one open meeting. I thought I owed it to myself at least to do a little research on the Corporation, and past and present distributors. Never have I felt so relieved! You probably helped prevent me from making a very poor decision. Now I've got to summon the courage to let down the poor schlep who recruited me. Unlike you, I might not bail out until I get my free hamburger. :-) ps. For a minute there, I felt just like the tempted virgin writing to thank Ann Landers for saving her.
Subject: primerica Fri, 27 Nov 1998 Are all multilevel marketing companies similar to Amway? It seems there are hundreds of people trying to do the same thing, from phone cards to financial services. The most recent one I found is Primerica Financial Services. It sounds just like multilevel marketing with another product.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 2) Sat, 28 Nov 1998 I have a friend who has recently been dragged into the "Amway net". At first he talked about NETWORK marketing and when I said that it sounded the same as MULTILEVEL marketing he said I just was not willing to UNDERSTAND the business. So I went to the internet and found your story which confirms my worst fears and as you mentioned he and his wife have probably been indoctrinated into ignoring any contrarian advice of friends so I am hesitant to broach the subject. Do you have any advice? Keep spreading your story.
Subject: Amway Mon, 30 Nov 1998 Hi There, Do you hate Amway? What are your feelings on it? PS. Do you know Jim Dornan?
Subject: Your Amway page... Mon, 30 Nov 1998 You ever wondered: If you put as much time and effort into your job, life, family, etc...as you do into trying to bash Amway and other peope dreams, how much better your life might be? I've done my Amway research through unatached, impartial means, like the BBB, FTC, Direct selling association, independent researchers, etc....It strikes me as funny that they all disagree with you. Should I believe you, or several credible, well known organizations? Nothing personal, but you lose. By the way, are you aware that Sidney Schwartz is paid by Proctor and Gamble(who have been twice admonished by the courts for bad behavior), and, it has now been alleged, put up false information and "testamonials" on his web site for money?
Subject: smart guy Tue, 01 Dec 1998 hi, i just read your story on amway, as long as you cut loose you are smart!!!!, hey, i was invited to one of those meeting and i was turned off because they diddn`t even offer snack for all those long hours in exchange for all the bull crap (like we both heard), its funny, if they are so rich with all those billion sure they could offer a cookie. anyways, that was just my humor of it but i immediately became suspicious from the start and decided in a jiffy that this diddn`t sound right at all, atleast not for me. i feel good that i did not do anything of the sort, anyways, best wishes for the future. oh, i forgot to tell you,....my MAJOR turn off was the worshipping of the speaker, i felt VERY VERY uncomfortable with that, i worship no man in that manner, only christ deserves such adoration and i neglect him(sometimes) muchless a mere manupilative man. oh by the way, that picture with your cat look cute:)
Subject: My reply to your Amway page Wed, 02 Dec 1998 I just spent the last 2 hours looking at what you and other people have to say about Amway. I want to know, you talk about Amway as if they are a bad company. It's not Amway that is bad , it's people like you and other who joined, got in , or what ever you want to call it, that have made it this way. I have been a distributor for 4 years now, and no I am not rich (yet) but I am getting what I put in to it. The truth is you get out of it what you put in to it. If you put the same effort in to a Taco Bell as you did your Amway business you would of failed Why don't you talk about the 7-11's Circle K, AM/PM Arco, Mobil, Shell, Texaco, Taco Bells, Jack in the Box, McDonalds Subway, Auto Zones or any of the other real cheap opportunities? Well I'll tell you why, You don't care, that's why. I can put $ 250,000.00 CASH in to any one of these opportunities, as one might call them, put my house up, spend my lifes savings train for 1 year and in 1 to 5 years loose it ALL. Thats o.k. right. Sure the American dream! You want to belittle spending $ 160.00 (+/- these days) a small amout of money compared to $ 250,000.00 +/- and you are making a BIG deal of it. $ 160.00 that can net you 250,000.00 per year! Yes thats right, if you put 40-60 hours in to a Amway business like you would a McDonald's in 2-5 years will will make that kind of $$$$$$, however, you like most won't lift a finger to build a Amway business like they show you, but you would do it for a McDonald's and I know why, because you spent $ 250,000.00 that's why. not $ 160.00 +/-. You don't even have $ 250,000.00. I say, "GET A LIFE"! Don't you have anything better to do? Why don't you help the homeless, help the AMERICAN childern who are out on the streets, give food to the poor, help your local church do something other than complaining about a opprotunity that can help the homeless, the poor, the local churchs. Oh, I am sorry, you just want to sit around and try to take the opportunity and make a mouuntian out of a mole hole. Why don't you help save people from buying 7-11, McDonald's, Burger King, Wendy's Subway, Auto Zone Circle K, Mobil so they don't loose $ 250,000.00 or more! Look Amway is a great business opportunity, you might not like it but the truth is the truth! 40 Years and growing! $7+ billion in sales last year. Might you spend your time doing something that can really help people save money, real money, big money.
Subject: Home Page Wed, 02 Dec 1998 Liked your home page, how about designing my main page for me!!!
Subject: Your Amway story (part 3) Wed, 02 Dec 1998 Dear Mr. Glasser, I had to write and thank you for your website. I read your story with compelling interest. You were right on the money. My husband is an Amway rep., though I've been against it, and I've been trying for almost a year to make him wake up. Reading your story sent shivers through me. It really is scary what the Scamway organization has been doing, what they are doing, and how they're hurting so many people. "People helping people," they like to chant. Horse hockey! Scary indeed. I just want to say thank you and hope that you help others. I think you ought to publish this story in book form, so that it's accessible to everyone. I wish you the best. Thank you again.
Subject: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 Hello, Just a quick note to let you know that I read your website concerning the Amway Business Deal. I was approached by Amway several years back and declined to join. (At the time I felt it to very cultist and just did not feel comfortable with it). Today, I was again approached by the Amway Business Deal, from another person, that sounds strangely like the person, Ted, you describe. I too decided to search the Internet and see what I could find. (Hence your page). Thank you for the insight.
Subject: Your Amway page... Fri, 4 Dec 1998 Hello Russell my name is *****, and I was wondering what gives you the right to ditch Amway.
Uhhh... the first amendment to the U.S. Constitution?
Subject: Sun, 06 Dec 1998 How many new businesses start each year? How many of those new businesses are bankrupt in the first 3 years? I don't see any of those statistics here. Why don't we buy a McDonalds franchise. It'll only cost $500,000+ cash up front and your guaranteed no competition from any other McD's, Burger Kings, Wendy's, etc. In addition to no competition there is the added benefit of turning your franchise over to the McDonalds Corp when you are ready to retire. Forget trying to leave anything to your children, you don't own it. You're renting it!! You seem to have all the answers. Why don't you post the statistics on how much Amway pays out to deceased distributors that have reached the level of Direct Distributor or above? It's in excess of $100 Million a year.
Subject: My reply to your Amway page Sun, 6 Dec 1998 Russel, I am a distributor in Toronto, Canada. I have been in the business since May of 1996, about two and a half years now. During this time period, I have listened to hundreds of tapes, read about 15 books, attended about 20 large seminars and rallies, and dozens of Open Meetings, Nuts and Bolts', Emerald Leaderships and Product Expo's. I am 27 year's old, have 2 university degrees, a great career, am a reasonable person and feel I am knowledgeable enough about Amway (see above) to make an intelligent comment. To be fair, I have worked the business sporadically, inconsistently, and not to my full ability (most people consider me a sharp, relatable individual). One reason I have not put my heart into Amway is the lingering doubts and inconsistencies that surround my experience with the business. Even though I get the sense from factual information, and my gut instincts, that this is a viable, potentially profitable business vehicle, I have never felt quite comfortable with the "Amway Experience." Why? My upline have shown their efforts and dedication to this "people-helping-people business" to be inconsistent and unprofessional. Sample this: from me to my first Emerald, my upline includes: a 24 year-old (my sponsor), who has been in the same time as me and who has sponsored only me; a disk-jockey who now sells real estate (during prime Plan-showing time), instead of pursuing this most wonderful opportunity; a chiropractor with tons of potential who has now joined Melaleuca (sp?); a plumber (my Profit-Sharing Direct) who I have never seen bring a new personal to an Open Meeting (I think he is really a "flamingo"--one-legged); and a very sharp and successfull Sapphire Direct who told me he was too busy to do evening meetings for me, and that the rest of my upline (see above!) would be able and willing to fill in!!! (My thoughts: these are supposed to be my role-models, and my "consellors," the people I am supposed to bring my family and friends to? No wonder I concentrated on cold-contacting!). I now believe that success in this business is very dependent upon the strength of your working upline. Why? In Amway jargon, your upline MUST build Depth beneath you to help make you successful. (Getting a leg 20 deep beneath you is your sponsor's and his upline's goal). If they are unwilling, uncommitted or simply incapable (eg. due to a lack of people skills), of starting you on the road to this goal, you will have a very hard row to hoe. Remember that as a neophite, "unsuccessful" distributor, your "successful" upline is your only day-to-day credibility when showing the plan to a prospect. Moreover, your energy to go full tilt in the business will be zapped by a weak upline. You will feel a strong urge to keep your family and friends away from these people for fear of being embarrased later in the future. This is a long-winded way of warning people who are considering the business to make sure that you have a very strong upline. This means that ALL people ACTIVE between you and your first large pin (Diamond, Emerald, Sapphire, Ruby), are good, upstanding, decent, quality, RELATABLE, individuals. Some tapes and seminar speakers will actually tell you that the quality of your upline does not matter. It does. Your total confidence in the business depends on it. My advice, for what it's worth? If you are seriously considering the business, tell your upline you will join the business in about 1 year's time because you want to evaluate their performance during that period (ie. have they sponsored anybody, are they still active, are they still registered!!!). Seriously! If this is a good opportunity, it will be just as good an opportunity one year from now. This piece of advice may save you literally thousands of dollars in "System" expenses when you find out that in a year's time your upline are all complete duds, like most of mine are. Anyway, I think you can get stinking filthy rich in the business. I really do. But, as several articles on the net have pointed out, it comes at a really, really high price, not the least of which is that you may actually lose several close friends. I've been there, but that's another email. Aint it great? Maybe, but just not willing to find out. Toronto
Subject: Your Amway story (part 2) Sun, 6 Dec 1998 cked out your page. seems to contain opinion, as you stated. and we all know what opinions are like.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 2) Sun, 6 Dec 1998 one thing i have learned is whether it has been the twenty plus years in my current trade or being a distributor for a number of years is when someone gets fired from a job or fails in there own buisness the blame is often placed on others .i am so glad i was raised to work hard and not give up without a honest effort.well its nice to live in a country where we can have our own opinion. the next time you simply look at an opportunity or fail to succeed you might keep it to yourself out of respect for those people who have a dream and are willing to fight for it.good luck on what ever you may try next in the way of buisness opportunities. i can say in all honesty that building a distributership is not always easy .however it is a good feeling to know that i have dreams for my family and the amway opportunity gives us hope not guarantees. this may dissapoint you because it is not a flamed response ,however our buisness is built on character ,honesty, faith.
Subject: Re: Your Amway page... Sun, 6 Dec 1998 Why do you crusade against Amway? I have read your site, but I still do not see the reason, because you never lost anything in Amway. You never became an Amway distributor, and in all actuality you did poor research about Amway.
Subject: Finished your Amway story... Sun, 6 Dec 1998 Great site !! Luckily, I saw through the shmuck's smoke and mirrors pitch that came to my home the other night, but I decided to research on the internet and you confirmed my suspicions. The guy even told me as he left my house that I shouldn't talk to anyone about it !! What gets me the most is that the person who referred me to this creep was someone I had considered a friend ! I was going to try and talk some sense into her but after reading yours and other's experiences I am going to simply keep my mouth shut and be rid of both of them !!
Subject: finished your amway story... Mon, 7 Dec 1998 Thanks for the information on Amway. Amway is busy in South Africa for about two years. This weekend I was invited for the third time for an Amway "business opportunity". The previous two I just refused because of the pyramid or chain letter principle involved ( al though the presenters flatly deny that it is a pyramid or chain). I needed more information because these friends that invited me truly belief that they will be millionaires in five years time. I will take this information to them tonight and try to help them. Thanks
Subject: Your Amway page... Mon, 07 Dec 1998 Still Broke are we?
I don't know about the "we" part, but I'm sorry to hear that you're broke.
Subject: Thoughts on your web page/Amway Tue, 08 Dec 1998 Yesterday an amway couple visited my house in an effort to convince my husband and I to join. I had a bad feeling about three pages into their promotional literature, as it was obvious they were playing toward greed and conspicuous consumption. Well, my hubby invited them over to be polite, so we listened to their presentation, promised to give joining some thought, and then bid them a good night. They're expecting an answer tomorrow, so today I searched the web for information on Amway. Your page was one of the first one the search engine (google) turned up, and I read it with glee. The debate section was *wonderful.* Anyway, to make a long story short, I want to thank you for posting your story, and your girlfriend's. I don't know what reaction we will get when we tell the upline that we don't want to join, but whatever it is, I'm sure we'll be more prepared than we would have been hadn't we read your pages. All the best, ***** p.s. Just ran Netscape's speller on this, and learned the suggested replacement for "amway" is "away." Fitting, don't you think? :-)
Subject: Your Amway story (part 3) Thu, 10 Dec 1998 Great webpage! I have a good friend that got sucked into a MLM scheme. I drove all the way to Dallas since he had just gotten out of the military and I had not seen him for 6 years. He immeadiately "pitched" at me. Ruined a good friendship, the poor guy should be broke in a short while. Damn shame.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 3) Sat, 12 Dec 1998 I just read your info on Amway, and I must say it makes sense in comparison to what my brother has become. He joined Amway a year and a half ago and was totally sucked in. He is not the same person, he obsesses with joining people up, he has spent way too much money in traveling and meetings. He has a family of 5 children to support. Has a good job as a senior engineer with General Motors which he has been with for many years. He also has a side business working on race cars. Why in the world would he need to work any more and make any more than he has. He has had a good life, good family, good job and good friends. I am totally convinced that he has been brainwashed (or whatever). He has now turned his back on all that he has. I realized how bad Amway was for him when I sat in my mother's hospital room and listened to my brother talk about Amway. His comment was that "these people give me support, I don't get support at work, I don't get support at home or from you mom". What a crock of - you know what. My question to you is, how in the hell do I get my brother out of this before he loses everything he has; family, job and friends. Do you know of any way to get him out of this? We have considered some type of brainwashing de-programmer. Our family is very concerned.
Subject: Wed, 16 Dec 1998 Hi Russell, Checked out your web page when trying to research a strange visit from an acquaintance who mentioned a connection with Network 21. We've managed to work out that it has something to do with Amway but, strangely enough, their website is mysteriously unavailable. We are thoroughly sceptical of anything Amway and so enjoyed reading your site. But we've been unable to get any information on Network 21. Can you point us in the right direction? Or at least confirm that Amway and Network 21 are the same thing? We'd appreciate any help.
Subject: Finished your Amway story... Tue, 15 Dec 1998 Hey Russell.. Just got done reading over your story again. Heh. I haven't read it in about a year and a half and needed something to do here at work. You know? I had an idea -- You oughta find "Phil"'s email address and send him your URL and CC: it to "Ted". I'm sure he'll still insist that "you're a failure" and "you'll never succeed" with his brash comments about the Internet. Those people ... Oh my. I used to be one of them for several months and one day just woke up and realized that I didn't want to be married to those people anymore. It's disgusting; the business will encompass every single bit of your life and you wind up looking at people as if they were '$' figures. Keep up the good work.
Subject: Thanks for the info... Thu, 17 Dec 1998 Dear Russel, I just got done reading your entire story about Amway. I myself have been ambushed by an Amway salesman, and I fell for their scam. I had no prior knowledge of Amway when my friend approached me. Needless to say, I made a big mistake. I have officially been an Amway distributor for 4 days now. I have since educated myself with the facts I have found on the Internet, and I have decided I no longer want to have any affiliation with the "so called" business. I would like to thank you for sharing your story with me, and I cannot tell you how much it has helped me make a decision of leaving this business venture. The story was very enlightening and very well written. I will share the information I have learned from your web-site and other web-site concerning Amway. Thanks again,
Subject: My Thoughts on the subject Fri, 18 Dec 1998 Here's something refreshing....being negative about a pathetic soul such as yourself. Not only did you fail at the Amway business, you apparently have dedicated a significant portion of your time on a consistent basis to "prove" that it wasn't your own fault that you failed. But I suppose you would say that your web site is a beacon in a dog eat dog world to assist those would-be Amway distributors in not making a horrible mistake such as you did....how noble. I don't care to argue anything with you, don't have anything to prove, don't really care what you think. I really just wanted to rant. I think you're full of it (include your own definition of "it"). I'm "IN" Amway, have been for years. There are many people I can't stand that are "IN" my upline..many people I have deep respect for. They are not the reason I "GOT IN" Amway and they would never be a reason for me to get out. The world is full of idiots in and out of Amway...you prove the later. The reason I got in Amway is NONE OF YOUR FRIGGIN BUSINESS! nor anyone else's....DREAM SCHMEAM....everyone has dreams ... One of mine is for the Amway business to continue to prove you wrong. Ya know, here in Florida the chances of winnin the lottery are 14 million to 1 but just about every single week somebody wins that thing.....Well, every single year, no matter what you put on this crotchety web site that says "Amway's so hard and such a scam" there are hundreds of people that go flippin diamond, emerald, pearl, and direct. They smile, cry, luagh...cuase they are makin what you wanted to make when you got in Amway.... :) I'm smilin right now cause I know that if you were where you wanted to be financially you wouldn't have this need to cut on Amway and distributors. BTW, I'm not a diamond, emerald, pearl, blah, blah, blah and it is becuase of one reason....I am have been lazy, pure and simply. I haven't blamed my Mom or Dad, the State of Florida, the NTSB, FCC, FBI, CIA, Iraq, Iran or you....it's my fault. Grow up and do the same lame skull.
Who's the defensive one here? I find it difficult to see how this guy is "continuing to prove me wrong" in any way. Whoops -- guess I stole that dream too!
Subject: Finished your Amway story... Fri, 18 Dec 1998 Russel, a friend of mine (an ex-amway person who did not succeed in Amway), sent me your page the other night, and I am just now reading it. I have a son-in-law who is in Amway, and thinks the sun rises and sets on Amway (even though his cash-out is many times greater than his cash-in). I really do appreciate your web page. I am going to send it to my son-in-law, in hopes that he will "wake up" to the perils of amway. I have never spent this much time (several hours) reading anybody's web page (including my daughters, and I love her dearly), but I also have never met anybody (and I feel like I have met you) who shares my exact same views of Amway. thanks again, and keep up the good work.
Subject: Ginny's Amway story (part 3) Fri, 18 Dec 1998 Ginny, I have really enjoyed your story. As I wrote to Russell, I have a son-in-law who is going through the Amway "Mess", as I call it, and at the same time, he is putting his wife (my daughter), and her two children through this "Amway Mess". Amway really has people "brain-washed". I asked him the other day (on-line - I live in NC and they live in WA) to show me receipts of his Amway income, and then show me copies of his expenditures (he has been in Amway almost two years), and he hasn't talked to me since. I really do appreciate your thoughts, and the time you spent typing them to people (like me) who have problems with Amway. It helps me to understand better the psycho-technics that Amway is putting people through. Thanks again for the info you have shared. Dave
Subject: Your Amway story (part 1) Sat, 19 Dec 1998 No story! I was contacted by an Amway "friend" and he is stating Amway is going into the Virtual Mall business and I need to get into this business now to be one of the "elite". I am interested in the concept but after reading all the Amway negative info I am definitely backing off. What do you know about this "Virtual Mall"? Supposedly The Gap, Eddie Bauer, Amazon Books etc will be associated with Amway. You can earn "points" though purchases by someone using an "ID" number supplied by the Amway distributor.(me) When that person using your number reaches a certain level of purchasing he then could become a "distributor" and pass on his internet number to be used. You profit by more people under you using your recommended "distributor".I only got the basic idea from this guy. What's up do you know?
Subject: Finished your Amway story... Sun, 20 Dec 1998 Great story!
Subject: Your Amway page...INVITATION TO JOIN WEBRING Sun, 20 Dec 1998 Hello...I'm the ringmaster of the *Consumer ACTION & ADVICE Ring, * a webring of sites that provide useful, free consumer advice, education, or assistance. I just found your Amway site & would like to invite you to join C.A.A.R. We generate sufficient "hits" for our member sites to be rated in the Webring Top 100 for our category. For info/to join: http://homepages.infoseek.com/~coolcatdaddyo/caar/CAAR.htm
Subject: Your Amway story (part 2) Tue, 22 Dec 1998 must be a britt group burn out, as so it happens. But maybe you check out the Tim Foley group. I don't have time to peddle the products but i have time to refer and make an order which is the same as saying "hey joe, wallyworld has stuff on sale" you know what i mean>>>
Subject: FinishedyourAmwaystory... Tue, 22 Dec 1998 > You have finished reading the story of my experiences with Amway. I > can't BELIEVE you actually read that whole thing! What are you, some > kind of fanatic or something? :) Hi Russell, I'm a PhD student at McMaster University, Hamilton, Ontario, Canada, I really enjoyed your Amyway story. It parallels my Amway experience and will probablly help many potential victims see the truth. Seasons best,
Subject: Your Amway page... Wed, 23 Dec 1998 Hey Russell I was deeply touched and moved by your story. I lived a simualr experience with the famous Amaway cult. Two years ago, I was brainwashed to join, for the reasons of acheving wealth and dreams. My real dream was to work in the film industry. Amway had convinced me that it would be a good idea to have this business to finance me through university film school and I would be loaded with money has I pursue my studies. REALITIY HITS AFTER I JOIN ( I guess I learned the hard way). Being a full time student and working part time to support my studies, which college requires time and money. I taught Amway would luxe up my life and that in two years I will be riding a brand new Mustang to school instead of an 82 chevette and burnt oil. Do the Amway business and you will make tons of money, wrong. To get started I must spend two hundread dollars and after spend lots of money on seminars , tapes, and all kinds of bull crap, that only makes the upline rich. My direct distrubutor said at a meeting that I attended at his place said "A good amway distrubutor that will achieve success will spend a good 300$ a mounth to get his business off the ground, that's nothing compared to other busineses like a restaurant". What purpose does the tools I purchased from a Amway serve nothing? Its just brainwashing tools so I can continue to throw my hard earned money to make my upline which without getting any true value in return. After a while I realized that I can never accomplish my dreams if I stick with Amway. How can I invest time into my studies when I attend these Amway meetings and seminars. Secondly, If I put 300$ a mounth into Amway how can I afford my living expences tution fees? Amway dont care they just want my money. After all thats what the industry is all about, how can they rank their billon dollar income without the poor people in the bottom to pay paying the rich people on the top. iTS A PYRAMID ALL RIGHT, with Amway big dollars have braght it out to be legal. The same way a company buys a politician on polluting laws on thier corporation production. How stupid can the world be. Amway brainwashes thier down line to pay in into the business with fear and ignorance that unfortunantly thousands of people buy into it, because they cant think for themselves like you and I . A heard of sheap in a confused world! I would like to hear from you, Farewell
Subject: YourAmwaystory(part3) Wed, 23 Dec 1998 Hi my name is Joe. My wife and I owen the Pioneer Motel. I have had several businesses through-out my life. I do not believe in amways business practices and principles. I base my life and business on honesty. You can"t do that if your in amway. I like reading your web site. I am new at this web thing. Nice talking to you.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 3) Wed, 23 Dec 1998 Thanks for confirming my own impressions.
Subject: Your Amway story (part 3) Sun, 27 Dec 1998 Very interesting! The information out there is very true. I hope more people research. I would get into it to make the tapes and write the books, and then I can make millions!
Subject: Your Amway story (part 2) Mon, 28 Dec 1998 Russell, I learned a long time ago that you cannot argue with an idiot! My wife and I have been distributors for seven years now. We have never really pursued the marketing side of this business. What this business has done for us personally is worth every penny we've spent on information. It has helped our marriage grow stronger, our kids growing up in a healthy, loving home and my advancement at work. Ninety percent of our friends are not distributors and there are no ill feelings among us and the ones who didn't join. You appear to be very immature, unsuccessful in what you are trying to accomplish and a borderline computer geek with little or no people skills. Get a life!
I would have replied, but I've heard somewhere that you cannot argue with an idiot.
Subject: Your website is great!! Wed, 30 Dec 1998 Just a pat on the back from a (still signed up but not active) distributor!! You hit all the LOC nails on the head!!! [Laughing my ass off]. Your responses to all the "objections" we were indoctrinated with are hilarious!! Great job and keep it up!! Spread the word!!
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